SupaTunaGT
Online Events => GT Endurance Racing => Topic started by: Wolfpack987 on January 28, 2013, 01:01:30 PM
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Time for a classic battle between Japan's monster and America's war horse.
vehicles
-'07 Nissan GTR
-'06 Chevrolet Corvette Z06
Date: March 22nd at 9pm. Practice at 830, Qualifying at 840, race start at 9pm
Venue: Suzuka (no weather change)
Distance: 48 laps
Tires: Race MEDIUM
Tuning: prohibited
Damage: light
Tire wear/fuel consumption: fast
Driving assists allowed
-ABS
-Driving line
I believe these two vehicles to be fairly closely matched. The GTR has shorter gearing and AWD but is over 300 kg heavier and slightly down on power.
GTR
~500 hp (mine isn't broken in yet)
1740 kg
Z06
529 hp
1421 kg
Race Roster
WolfpackS2k - Z06
TunaPhreak - GTR
Feldynn - GTR
RickS95 - Z06
Turbo-Tuna -
DudeTuna -
AgentWD40_FL -
dlrws6 - Z06
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What's a good date for everyone? I'm thinking a Friday 1-2 months from now.
FYI, TunaCup Season 8 runs on Fridays until March 15th.
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These are fun. We need to have them more frequently. That is all.
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What's a good date for everyone? I'm thinking a Friday 1-2 months from now.
FYI, TunaCup Season 8 runs on Fridays until March 15th.
Good Lord, I knew they were run on Fridays but I didn't realize they were run on EVERY Friday. Fridays are actually not even my preferred days; I just know they work well for others. What day should we try for fellas? I can wait till March 22nd but I would really prefer not to.
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Wednesdays maybe? dlwrs6's evnet I believe only uses one Wednesday a month.
Also, sign me up. I'll need to try both cars before I pick one though.
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A Wednesday would be fine with me, or if you want we could even schedule this for a Thursday if that night would better suit most people (it sort of reminds me of ShoSho style evnet :)).
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Saturday night, in conjunction with the Drive-In. If this was the Drive-In, maybe we'd get a full grid of 16.
Just a guess, the Z06 becomes increasingly difficult to keep on the track as the tires start to wear???
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That's a good idea Rick. Maybe that's something that can be done this time around.
And yes, the Z06 gets twitchier than the GTR as the tires wear down. They wear down a bit slower though.
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Z06 here. I just got mine rebuilt and repainted after Daytona.
I also would like these to be more frequent. My series is once a month on Wednesdays although I've thought about picking the pace up a little. If you got to use Wednesday just pick a date and I'll work around it when planning Group C. No problem there. ;D
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I purchased both cars new yesterday and sent my B-spec drivers out to break them in. Now to find some time to take them around Suzuka and pick one.
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If you guys really want a Friday I'd be more than willing to insert a bye week into the TunaCup schedule.
I'm not trying to hog all the Fridays, I just wanted to get the season done as soon as possible.
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Fridays and Wednesdays work best for me.
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If you guys really want a Friday I'd be more than willing to insert a bye week into the TunaCup schedule.
I'm not trying to hog all the Fridays, I just wanted to get the season done as soon as possible.
Was hoping to hear something like this. Post of the week. And thanks for the offer Wiz. I'd like to see us take Wiz up on this offer.
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I tried them both out for a few laps at lunch. Good news is I'm equally slow in both @ 2'09.xxx. The odd thing is I seem to keep the vet on track better, but the GT-R will probably end up faster for me. They both exit the track in a hurry with only the tiniest of mistakes.
This will be a lot of fun. 8)
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In early testing (five laps on each car), this is the mismatch I expected. Nissan weighs more and has less horsepower, yet it's quicker, faster, handles better, and brakes better...and is much easier to handle. About the only category the Corvette wins is in sound and that's because the Nissan really doesn't have any sound.
In my five laps on each car, my best lap (and best is a relative term because even on my best lap I butchered a few things) in the Nissan is 2:08.4, while my best in the Z06, in a mostly clean run, was 2:10.0.
Still need to do some longer-term testing, but early on, the Nissan, as expected, is the go-to car. I really expected the Nissan to put the power to the ground better, but I didn't expect it to have less understeer than the Corvette. That said, I could feel the grip of the Nissan falling off by the 5rd lap and didn't notice it at all in the Corvette, but that could be because I fought the Corvette on every lap.
Will make some longer runs to check what happens when the threads start to show.
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If both cars have not achieved brake in that will make a difference.
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If both cars have not achieved brake in that will make a difference.
Both cars are broken in and ready for action. Except for the Corvette...it's broken in, but ready for pasture.
I ran 15 laps in the Corvette last night. It was starting to get hairy and I'm not sure I had enough fuel for a 16th lap. The car starts to fall off at a pretty good clip after 8 laps. What was weird is that I could take Degner almost as fast on shitty, worn tires as I could on fresh tires. The sweepers didn't prove much of a problem on worn tires, but the sharper turns and braking were a real problem. Actually, the more I think about it, in the two sweepers that come to mind, I took the turns under no throttle...in other sweepers with WOT, the car pushed and sometimes I had to lift.
Not working today so I'll run a full tank in the Nissan and see what happens.
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The racing hard tires, they do nothing. Neither one of the cars felt like they were on racing tires to me.
I'm curious if harder tires would help the balance of the cars or make them even worse.?
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More notes.
I just ran 14.5 laps in the Nissan before running out of gas. The Corvette takes 6.33 liters of fuel for each lap, the Nissan takes about 6.9...I haven't put pen to paper so I'm not sure that matters.
After taking out the Nissan for a longer run, I'm still not sure which car to favor. The Nissan is infinitely faster, almost everywhere on the track, except the longer straights where the Corvette can stretch her legs. The Nissan also likes to eat through rubber (particularly with my driving style), the fronts especially. However, you can still run good laps with the fronts wearing. My lap times started to fall off at the 7rd or 8nd lap in each car, but the Corvette lost more time on each lap after that.
The Nissan is easier to drive 99% of the time, but beware that 1% because it'll fuck you if you so much as look at the grass. And when the Nissan goes on off-track excursions it's an hour before you get the damned thing back on the track. I played in the sand twice in the first two laps and then again on lap 12 or 13. I might have gone off track once in the Corvette.
With the tires starting to show threads, I felt more concerned about a big spin coming out of nowhere in the Corvette than the Nissan. If you can keep calm, it probably won't be an issue, but I don't always keep calm during a race. Calmness will also affect the tires. I took the fronts down really, really far in both cars but I have a feeling during a race I'll burn through them even faster as I tend to drive like my hair is on fire if I'm chasing or being chased.
Technical track, twitchy cars.
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In seeing that this race is 48 laps, fuel consumption won't be an issue, and really, tires shouldn't be either since you have to fill up with fuel before the tires go bad and we're all going to have to stop 3 times.
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I remember a blade of grass that threw my Nissan off track a few times. (http://i.imgur.com/LmjyBgx.gif) I had almost forgotten about that.
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Rick, I appreciate your testing! It would appear you've been more thorough than I (http://i.imgur.com/LmjyBgx.gif)
I had honestly thought that the GTR would burn up it's front tires much faster (much like the R33/34's) than it does, and that it would start to understeer more. But it really doesn't! I guess Kaz really had a hard on for this car when programming the game :D It just doesn't seem right to me that the two cars more or less wear through tires at a similar rate, given the 400lb weight difference.
Perhaps the "regular" GTR would be a better match than the SpecV? I'll do some testing of it this weekend but Rick, if you have time today by all means give it a shot. It weighs an extra 80kg and should have less horsepower. And I suppose that match up would make more sense anyway, as the SpecV is JDM only ;)
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Nissan GT-R '07?
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Yup that's the one!
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I'm having Bob break in my car as I type this. Will run some laps when he's done.
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Maybe we will be able to multitask in GT6. Bobs can drive and we can do something too. Maybe the PS4 will allow us to multitask. We can let our bobs drive in GT6 and I can still watch Netflix. That might actually give me a reason to buy a Vita. Just so I can check in on Bob.
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The regular GT-R tips the scales at 1740 KG and pulls 508 HP on the dyno. It's got the same shitty sound as the Spec V car, but is a bit slower coming out of the twisties and at the end of the long runs.
My best lap was between the faster GT-R and the Corvette.
Spec V--8.4
Reg GT-R--9.2
Corvette--10.0
I got the same gas mileage, running out of gas after about 14.5 laps. The fronts left me pretty quick but the wear slowed down after they were 25% gone. Ultimately, I ran out of gas again before losing tires, but that last lap and a half was pretty ugly. I blew through my turns because the car wouldn't stop and the push into turns was far more pronounced. Like before, this doesn't matter because we'll be pitting after 12 laps.
The car handled exactly like the Spec V only with more weight. I still think the Corvette is a turd compared to both these.
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dammit. lol
Might have to go back to the drawing board here...
Or we could limit the GTR to 485 hp, which is what I believe the 2007 GTR was rated for in real life.
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There's pretty big disparity in PP between the ZR1 and the Spec V, but the times may be similar. Might try that later.
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Good deal. I'm occupied today but should have plenty of time tomorrow to spend on this.
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Good deal. I'm occupied today but should have plenty of time tomorrow to spend on this.
I only ran a few laps in the ZR1 and did it in a brand new car without an oil change. Off the showroom floor it registers 576 PP. It's a handful to drive, with all that power. Through the first check point, I was dead even with my time in the GT-R. However, after that, the ZR1 gets to use it's power a little better and runs laps just shy of a second faster per lap than even the Spec V version of the import. With an oil change, it would easily be a second faster per lap, though I'm not sure how tire wear would be. Like I said, it's not an easy car to drive...huge push under WOT.
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I spent some time yesterday comparing a fully broken in Z06 against a GTR with it's engine output reduced to 485 hp. Still seemed like an unfair advantage.
I'm thinking that perhaps a switch to race medium tires could benefit the Z06 a bit (more than GTR) and even things. Hopefully can test out that theory tonight.
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I spent some time yesterday comparing a fully broken in Z06 against a GTR with it's engine output reduced to 485 hp. Still seemed like an unfair advantage.
I'm thinking that perhaps a switch to race medium tires could benefit the Z06 a bit (more than GTR) and even things. Hopefully can test out that theory tonight.
Couple things. First, has anyone else run these two cars? Just because I found one to be better than the other doesn't mean everyone else will. If I remember right, I thought one of the cars in the previous enduro was a go-to car when no one else did. Maybe the Nissan worked better with my driving style. As an aside, when we did some testing back in Prologue, a few of us noted that the stock GT-R was actually faster than after we made modifications to it.
Second, any thoughts to just having a single model race? Variety is great, but seemingly not when a GT-R is involved.
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I spent some time yesterday comparing a fully broken in Z06 against a GTR with it's engine output reduced to 485 hp. Still seemed like an unfair advantage.
I'm thinking that perhaps a switch to race medium tires could benefit the Z06 a bit (more than GTR) and even things. Hopefully can test out that theory tonight.
Couple things. First, has anyone else run these two cars? Just because I found one to be better than the other doesn't mean everyone else will. If I remember right, I thought one of the cars in the previous enduro was a go-to car when no one else did. Maybe the Nissan worked better with my driving style. As an aside, when we did some testing back in Prologue, a few of us noted that the stock GT-R was actually faster than after we made modifications to it.
Second, any thoughts to just having a single model race? Variety is great, but seemingly not when a GT-R is involved.
I'm all for a single malt, er um model.
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I spent some time yesterday comparing a fully broken in Z06 against a GTR with it's engine output reduced to 485 hp. Still seemed like an unfair advantage.
I'm thinking that perhaps a switch to race medium tires could benefit the Z06 a bit (more than GTR) and even things. Hopefully can test out that theory tonight.
Couple things. First, has anyone else run these two cars? Just because I found one to be better than the other doesn't mean everyone else will. If I remember right, I thought one of the cars in the previous enduro was a go-to car when no one else did. Maybe the Nissan worked better with my driving style. As an aside, when we did some testing back in Prologue, a few of us noted that the stock GT-R was actually faster than after we made modifications to it.
Second, any thoughts to just having a single model race? Variety is great, but seemingly not when a GT-R is involved.
I don't really think there was a "go to" car in the last enduro. I believe the top 3 finishers all had different cars. As to this race, I really like keeping at least 2 cars in the ring. And if people don't think the GTR will work, I have something else in the wings that seems quite equal to the Z06, that comes from that boot shaped country... ;)
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I spent some time yesterday comparing a fully broken in Z06 against a GTR with it's engine output reduced to 485 hp. Still seemed like an unfair advantage.
I'm thinking that perhaps a switch to race medium tires could benefit the Z06 a bit (more than GTR) and even things. Hopefully can test out that theory tonight.
Couple things. First, has anyone else run these two cars? Just because I found one to be better than the other doesn't mean everyone else will. If I remember right, I thought one of the cars in the previous enduro was a go-to car when no one else did. Maybe the Nissan worked better with my driving style. As an aside, when we did some testing back in Prologue, a few of us noted that the stock GT-R was actually faster than after we made modifications to it.
Second, any thoughts to just having a single model race? Variety is great, but seemingly not when a GT-R is involved.
I don't really think there was a "go to" car in the last enduro. I believe the top 3 finishers all had different cars. As to this race, I really like keeping at least 2 cars in the ring. And if people don't think the GTR will work, I have something else in the wings that seems quite equal to the Z06, that comes from that boot shaped country... ;)
Am I seeing a Ferrari purchase in my future?
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Myself, Phreak and nosoks ran several races last night one being a 20 lap affair and the others 4-6 laps between the base GTR and Z06. The difference maker this time was the use of Race Medium tires. The cars seem very closely matched when using this stickier rubber.
I think this is the configuration to use. The Z06 was faster than the GTR through 3 of the 4 segments and consistently put down faster lap times. However there is a much smaller margin for error with the Z06 over the GTR. 10 laps seems to be about as far as the tires will last. At that point the Z06 is down to 10-15% tread front and rear. GTR about 10% fromt 40% rear I think (Phreak and nosoks ran the GTRs not me). Best lap time I had in the Z06 was a 2:06.980. I don't think either Phreak or nosoks broke below the mid 2:08s.
Basically if you want a challenge in the this race pick the Z06. Either car can win. Given no driving errors the Z06 should be hands down faster.
OP has been updated to reflect these regulation changes...
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Yeah, lots of goos times last night testing out. I think the RM's may shift the balance slightly in the vette's favor, but driving style will certainly play a large part in here. I don't think you're going to get much closer using untuned cars than teh RM races we had last night, looking forward to it!
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Does anyone want to meet in a lounge and run some laps to try out these cars? I've run both the Corvette and the GT-R and I'm still undecided. Would like to try each in the heat of battle to see what happens to tire wear.
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Does anyone want to meet in a lounge and run some laps to try out these cars? I've run both the Corvette and the GT-R and I'm still undecided. Would like to try each in the heat of battle to see what happens to tire wear.
Sure, you want to do 30 laps Saturday morning?
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Does anyone want to meet in a lounge and run some laps to try out these cars? I've run both the Corvette and the GT-R and I'm still undecided. Would like to try each in the heat of battle to see what happens to tire wear.
Sure, you want to do 30 laps Saturday morning?
Depends on what 'morning' means to you.
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Does anyone want to meet in a lounge and run some laps to try out these cars? I've run both the Corvette and the GT-R and I'm still undecided. Would like to try each in the heat of battle to see what happens to tire wear.
Sure, you want to do 30 laps Saturday morning?
Depends on what 'morning' means to you.
I'm west coast and could be ready at 7am. I know 10am may be a little late in the morning for you, but I don't feel like getting up too much earlier. :)
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All I knows is, when you're on the 10th lap with one set of tires in the Z06 you CANNOT flat foot it through turn 12. If you try it you can get ready to wave good-bye to the back of the car as it passes you around 135 mph (http://i.imgur.com/LmjyBgx.gif)
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/ec/Suzuka_circuit_map--2005.svg/260px-Suzuka_circuit_map--2005.svg.png)
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All I knows is, when you're on the 10th lap with one set of tires in the Z06 you CANNOT flat foot it through turn 12. If you try it you can get ready to wave good-bye to the back of the car as it passes you around 135 mph (http://i583.photobucket.com/albums/ss272/james_mikel/STGT%20forum/lol1.gif)
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/ec/Suzuka_circuit_map--2005.svg/260px-Suzuka_circuit_map--2005.svg.png)
I have trouble in turn 7 as well. It either pushes me into the sand on the right or the ass end passes the front end and puts me into the wall on the left.
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Does anyone want to meet in a lounge and run some laps to try out these cars? I've run both the Corvette and the GT-R and I'm still undecided. Would like to try each in the heat of battle to see what happens to tire wear.
Sure, you want to do 30 laps Saturday morning?
Depends on what 'morning' means to you.
I'm west coast and could be ready at 7am. I know 10am may be a little late in the morning for you, but I don't feel like getting up too much earlier. :)
I don't blame you Dude and I'd never ask you to get up early on a Saturday because I know I don't want to have to. Let me check at home and see if I've planned something I don't remember and I'll get back with you. Maybe we can get a handful of guys so it's like a real race.
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aye, the turn in point and throttle modulation is important for turn 7. I try to hold 3rd gear through that turn but if the tires are worn down a bit the understeer will push you off into the sand.
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Does anyone want to meet in a lounge and run some laps to try out these cars? I've run both the Corvette and the GT-R and I'm still undecided. Would like to try each in the heat of battle to see what happens to tire wear.
Sure, you want to do 30 laps Saturday morning?
Depends on what 'morning' means to you.
I'm west coast and could be ready at 7am. I know 10am may be a little late in the morning for you, but I don't feel like getting up too much earlier. :)
I don't blame you Dude and I'd never ask you to get up early on a Saturday because I know I don't want to have to. Let me check at home and see if I've planned something I don't remember and I'll get back with you. Maybe we can get a handful of guys so it's like a real race.
I will await your schedule. And yes more racers better. :)
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Sorry Dude. I spent some time at the end of the week in a hell hole of a city north of the shitty city where I live.
Would like to get in some practice for this before the event, so I need to ask, do we have a date set yet?
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I'm going to ask TunaWiz if there's a Friday he's willing to bump the TunaCup series off of for us to use.
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How does Friday March 8th work for everyone? If we want to move forward with this date the TunaCup event scheduled that night will be moved, so don't let that factor into your decision.
Lemme know ASAP!
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Date is fine.
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Jeez, another month?
I have no life so I'm available pretty much anytime.
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Sorry Rick. I figured some people might be doing Valentine's Day related stuff this Friday (also it's too short notice). Phreak and I will be away on a ski trip next Friday night, and the following Friday night I'll be out of town as well. March 8th is the next date after that ;D
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So...um,
Does this date work?
Chime in any time plz ;)
(obviously not referring to Rick or Dude)
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Marco?
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(http://andrew1769.files.wordpress.com/2010/07/11970934971962387580johnny_automatic_polo_pony_svg_hi1.png)
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Where's the like button? ^^^
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Are we still doing this thing?
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Are we still doing this thing?
03/08/13 is out there and waiting for racers to commit.
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Are we still doing this thing?
03/08/13 is out there and waiting for racers to commit.
I'll be there in the Corvette.
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I'll be there in a Corvette as well!
I think I'm going to PM everyone that's expressed interest in this at some point. Replies in the last 2-3 weeks have been pretty weak! :(
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Bump.
Just want to make sure it's not a two man race. That would be boring, especially since I can't drive Suzuka for shit as I like to play in the sand every few laps.
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I'll be there Rick. I'd like to know who's planning on racing for car choice. I don't want to take the Vette if everyone else is.
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I'll be in the Corvette but I think TunaPhreak will be in the GTR.
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Corvette for me. Thanks
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I'm on the injured reserve list. I have a very swollen sore thumb. I went to the doctor yesterday, where they took blood and are running some tests. All I can say now is if it's better on Friday I will race.
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I shouold be there in a shiny new GT-"Arrrgggh"!
:pirate
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I'm on the injured reserve list. I have a very swollen sore thumb. I went to the doctor yesterday, where they took blood and are running some tests. All I can say now is if it's better on Friday I will race.
I've seen you race, are you sure a bumb thumb will matter? :lolz
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I'm on the injured reserve list. I have a very swollen sore thumb. I went to the doctor yesterday, where they took blood and are running some tests. All I can say now is if it's better on Friday I will race.
I've seen you race, are you sure a bumb thumb will matter? (http://i583.photobucket.com/albums/ss272/james_mikel/STGT%20forum/zLOL.gif)
LMAO (http://i.imgur.com/LmjyBgx.gif)
Sooooo, it now looks like I might not be able to attend the race this Friday. Unless people have plans, could we possibly bump this one week? :o
If not that's okay :P
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I'm on the injured reserve list. I have a very swollen sore thumb. I went to the doctor yesterday, where they took blood and are running some tests. All I can say now is if it's better on Friday I will race.
I've seen you race, are you sure a bumb thumb will matter? (http://i583.photobucket.com/albums/ss272/james_mikel/STGT%20forum/zLOL.gif)
Indeed. LOL
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I'm on the injured reserve list. I have a very swollen sore thumb. I went to the doctor yesterday, where they took blood and are running some tests. All I can say now is if it's better on Friday I will race.
I've seen you race, are you sure a bumb thumb will matter? (http://i583.photobucket.com/albums/ss272/james_mikel/STGT%20forum/zLOL.gif)
Indeed. LOL
It's ok, Dozer. I'm no different. Sometimes my best races are run after 36 ounces of the heavy stuff.
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Sooooo, it now looks like I might not be able to attend the race this Friday. Unless people have plans, could we possibly bump this one week? :o
If not that's okay :P
I don't have a problem bumping it back a week, but for it might present a conflict with the Tuna Cup (at least for me) if a rescheduling arrangement can't be made there too.
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If you need to push it back a week, can y'all just push it 2 please? If so, I'd like to take this week back and the last race is the 15th. I'm dying to get this season of TunaCup over with.
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If you need to push it back a week, can y'all just push it 2 please? If so, I'd like to take this week back and the last race is the 15th. I'm dying to get this season of TunaCup over with.
I'm tired if driving that piece if shit car too. It's practically undrivable. I'm surprised I can finish a lap in it. ::)
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If you need to push it back a week, can y'all just push it 2 please? If so, I'd like to take this week back and the last race is the 15th. I'm dying to get this season of TunaCup over with.
Understood! Thats fine with me. Though I hope I'm not angering anyone with this delay. I do realize that the planning and organization for this event has been sub-par. Bad combination of planned availability, fluctuating interest level here, and outside personal events. I'll strive to prevent this in the future.
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REMINDER!
RACE IS THIS FRIDAY!!!
If anyone is backing out please let me know.
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is this be tanite? :-\
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Yes.. I think!
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...k, ill bring a vette.
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yup!
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I may or may not be there. I was in my lounge getting ready for this, left to go over my son's science homework, and now I have no sound in either the game or regular TV. Normally, turning off the TV and back on does the trick or just switching through the different devices, but right now I've got nothing.
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Was fun. A little long, but fun.
When's the next one?
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Was fun. A little long, but fun.
:stoopid:
That was definitely the longest single race I've ever run but I did enjoy it, thanks Dawnson for running it :).
Also here are the results:
1nd: Rick
2nth: Grill
3st: Feld
4rd: Turbo
5nd: Dawson (DNF)
6st: Phreak (DNF)
Also I hate that the POSN was causing problems again tonight :(, almost seems like every time Sony forces an update upon us the network craps all over us for a few days.
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Thanks for the kind words. I'll have another one announced soon. And it will be shorter...promise!
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It was a good race. I almost managed to give feldynn a race in the closing stage of the race, but I messed up too much a few laps in a row. Rick and Grill kicked our asses. Good job guys.
Thanks for the race Dawson....btw...you need some profile updates here and a few other places. Scrap the vtec salute man. Wolfpack86?
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Well I feel a little better now. Checked out my car post-failure and noticed that I guess from prior practicing, I totally needed an oil change that was never performed, so I came into the race 8pp short or so. Makes me feel slightly better, like maybe I could have seen more tail lights longer if I was in a proper car :)
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Wow... i can't believe i missed this.... *sigh* Curse you Fortinet!!!!! *growls darly and flicks his tail before raising his purple gem covered staff of divine doom*
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When's the next race and what kind of car do I need to buy?
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Sorry I haven't announced anything yet. Between some trips and finishing the La Sarthe enduro I haven't had a lot of spare time :o
Right now I'm thinking FWD Honda Type Rs @ Deep Forest or Trial Mount on SS tires. Gotta do testing though.